Monday, 04 August 2014

We have to earn the right to be a European nation

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Euromaidan activist and leader of the public movement «Chesno» answered the questions about the situation in Ukraine and the possible development of the situation.

During the interview Svetlana Zalishchuk shared her opinion about recent events in Ukraine, explained importance of reforms and presidential elections, and also mentioned the importance of developing a civil society.

Most people in Ukraine want to be in the European Union. We remember the Stefan Fule’s statement that Ukraine can start a dialogue with the EU about entering EU. In your opinion what are the chances of Ukraine to become a member of US at the moment?

– In my opinion, neither Ukraine nor EU is ready for Ukraine as a member of the European Union. And it's absolutely natural. At the same time European Union has sent a very important message, they are willing to accept Ukraine, but we have to do our so called homework. We should build and organize the work of all democratic institutions then EU will want and accept us.

Neither European Union nor leaders of opposition will do this job for us. We are this kind of civil society that will stand and fight out the right to be considered to be European people and a European nation.

Evromaydan made it clear, until we build European Union in Ukraine it’s too early to talk about joining EU. We must hold European reforms in every workplace, in every sectors of the economy, in our culture.

To defeat corruption is a very important task, but until it becomes a part of our culture on a personal level and a part of our mentality, we will not be that part of Europe we are talking about now.

Do we have now the right political elite, which can lead Ukraine to EU? How does west perceive the Ukrainian politicians who might come to power?

– Regarding Western politicians, my answer, definitely, yes. Yatseniuk as prime minister on the same wavelength with the Europeans, it is his level. Perhaps his mission as one of the leaders Evromaydan was questioned, but now, according to the opinion poll, more than 50% of Ukrainians support him as a prime minister.

As for the question, if we have the right political elite, I think, in fact, the key point is that we have the right civil society.

What is the difference between 2004-2005 and now? .. At that time we chose a Messiah, and left home to wait when Yushchenko holds reforms. But we as civil society did not do anything to make it happen.

Now we have grown up. We learned that it’s not enough just to change the name and face of the authority. You need to work long and hard to make real changings.

So, the most important thing is not what elite we have, but what civil society, and whether this society is capable to control the power, force to make reforms and to help implementing them, because we must be involved in this process and act straightforwardly.

Ukraine has always had the only way when orders came "down" from the top. Can we be sure that Ukrainians are ready to make a change at all levels?

– It would be more effective if it is a two-way street. Now we have this opportunity, and it’s not going to last for a long time when it can work out. On one hand, there is a will of the new political elite. On the other hand, there is a will of society to accept different rules of the game, to stop corruption, maybe suffer, pay more, but to do something and make a real change.

Evromaydan was a revolution of dignity, when people were really willing to suffer, to stand under the bullets, because they knew they were standing for the core of existence of the Ukrainians as a nation.

The implementing reforms takes time but the referendum can be already announced in the second round of president elections, and the result is difficult to predict. What can we do now?

– It seems to me that the referendum is an attempt of the government to start a dialogue with the people. I am sure that if Ukraine had had a referendum with the question (whether eastern and southern regions want to join Russian Federation, ed.), and there would not have been Russia, that is destabilizing the situation in the country, it would have been a reassuring factor.

If now the local authorities hold referendums, and the government will continue avoiding it, then it will be a definite sign for people that the government does not want to listen to people’s opinion.

What do you think about the destabilization of Eastern Ukraine? Can the elections be sabotaged, and how long this situation at Eastern Ukraine can last?

– At the moment authorities are ready to hold elections under any conditions. Even if some of the regions are not able to take part, the election will take place anyway. We have no choice. We need a legitimate government. We need a concentration of resources and government is one of the resources and it should be legitimate. That’s why it is very important to hold president elections.

But it is very difficult to elect a president who will suit both sides. History shows that last 2 times a president was elected from one part of Ukraine. In addition, it comes from the politicians themselves that Ukraine is different and there is no support of one candidate.

– In our country, the difference is synonymous of hostility. If you're different, you're an enemy. But the problem is in politicizing the issue. There are a lot of different countries in the world, but they found the political way how to make agreements. Despite of different languages they respect each other.

No one explained us this before; and this is the biggest problem. There was no real dialogue. For 20 years our life has been like a football game. We had two football teams which played on either side of the field. We must realize that and start playing one game without separation.

Until we solve issues of identity and accept each other the way we are, we are going to have this opposition. If we are going to join EU not taking into account the interests of those who live in the east and south of the country, not explaining them why we should move in this direction, we will separate completely, and there will not be a country like Ukraine.

Yes, but after a long information war and pumping in the theme of differences between Ukrainians by politicians, how to explain it to people now? How to demonstrate that Ukrainians are united?

– Today, the government should re-sign a social contract with the country. There are two ways how to do it.

First is cooperation and co-existence of government and society. So far we have always had kings and slaves. We have never had working democratic institutions, where people would be elected by the democratic way actually to represent our interests. There was political corruption at the highest level. Today the government should offer people different conditions for the coexistence. Completely different institutions should be built.

Second, you need to find questions to get us back together in the future. In the past we had many issues to separate us. We need to show people in the east, first of all it’s in their interests to join EU.

We must find a way to overcome stereotypes. Then we will be able to make up, we will be a united country and it will make us stronger.

How can we deliver this information to people who do not want and do not like to read and analyze?

– We're not the only country that is going through difficult political events, phases, periods and processes. And as experience shows, if there is political will, there is no need to distribute brochures.

One thing is to read brochures, and another is to see that the reform is actually occurred. We can decide ourselves at the local level how to invest money. Then people do not have to read anything, they will see it.

If there are real reforms, judicial, law enforcement, in the economy and business, there is no a "phone call" method of solving problems, if people really start defeating corruption and eradicate it at the whole vertical, this will be the first message to the whole society, including people in the east. Everyone will understand, the authorities are different, and it is possible to cooperate.

Translation by Oksana Iocco

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